angrybacteria: The cruelest thing is that Katia is really happiest when she is drunk. Couldn't have a care in the world, just enjoying herself regardless of what the next day may bring. Such a pity.
Not sure if this is anywhere on the borru already.
Geravind: Is that a stone or a rhino behind them?...
What do they hold -- beer mugs? ...body scrubbers? ...coin purses?
Has an insect just landed near his right eye?
"Hey, what's up with you, man?"
=o_o= Lord of plots taught this one to trust not a damn thing around.
Nice style though.
MetalC0Mmander: @ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: Dude there isn't 10 different kind of happiness. I'm not saying it's smart but at least recognise it for what it is.
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: @MetalC0Mmander: I AM, recognizing it for what it is. She is an alcoholic, just cause when she is fueling her addiction doesn't mean she is happy. Happiness in the midst of a true addiction is always an illusion. All it leads to is avoiding the problem that is making her sad. Besides, we've seen how happy she is by being successful.
Also remember she blacks out the majority of the time, so she never really 'enjoys her self'. She said she was even sometimes conscious enough remember the stupid shit she did while drunk.
I don't get it, why do some in the prequel community justify her alcoholism? It's a problem she shouldn't embrace as its why she failed most of her life.
PermanentFace: @PermanentFace: To clarify, I'm not trying to justify her alcoholism. Prequel is driven by Katia's efforts to escape those parts of herself that she doesn't like - alcoholism, promiscuity, nightmares. But although her habits are self-destructive, and I appreciate her efforts to escape, I don't think you can claim that because she doesn't remember, or because she's suffering from addiction, the happiness she feels when drunk is less 'real.' The tragedy, like angrybacteria says, is that she is most at ease when she stops trying, and gives in to her most damaging impulses.
MetalC0Mmander: @PermanentFace: That's pretty much what I meant. Thanks for writting my reply for me. Wish I had something to give you in return... here have an happy cat! Wait I think I ducked up.
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: I talked to one of my mentors at AA, they could better explain this than I.
She experiences numbness and temporary relief from emotional pain, that is not happiness. Especially when she sobers up, all that emotional pain is back, and even worse than before.
AMKitsune: Looks to me like they're having a nice laugh while telling tipsy stories in some hot springs. Nothing too wild or sexual in any way. Sure she canonicly can't hold her drink and often ends up completely shit-faced once she starts, but this scene looks nothing like that.
Katia must either be drinking something very light here, or this is an alternate reality where she can handle her booze .
Whatever the case, it's nice to see them both having a good laugh (Whoever he is. Nameless Nord? Fan character? Who knows?)
Adroma: I can vouch for TGWAKW. When an alcoholic drinks, it's because they feel like it's the only thing they can do. Giving in, in a sense, is giving up. The worst part about blacking out is that you always have to face the cringy stuff you did while completely smashed. Like friendships you might have ruined or in Katia's case, the awkward moment when you meet the guy you just banged for the first time sober.
MetalC0Mmander: Ok maybe there's more than one way to be happy but anyway let me propose this hypotetical senario where someone could get all the benifits of alchool permenantly without any of the problems. Would it be happiness? Well you might say that person wouldn't need this kind of happiness if they didn't have any emotional pain to begin with but no that doesn't sound possible does it. Everyone has problems sometimes and they have to be able to rationalise them enough to be able to move over them somehow.
And don't get me wrong I'm not saying that any kind of addictions magicaly fix problems or won't cause more but when someone tells you those make them feel better the least you can do is try to understand them.
Adroma: @MetalC0Mmander: I can see what you mean. Being in an alchol dazed state does make you happy for a really short time, if you try not to focus on the fact that you're piss drunk.
PermanentFace: @ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: It's obviously not a good thing, but happiness is only associated with 'good' by connotation. Happiness is a feeling, so insofar as it makes her feel happy (however temporarily), it makes her happy. There's a golden tragedy in the fact that only through self-destruction is she able to find her highest happiness, and it's that tragedy that we're trying to revel in right now.
Alcoholism isn't a good thing. It's untenable, it leads to deeper troughs of despair in the aftermath, and Katia's struggle to overcome it is altogether admirable. I'm rooting for her all the way. But that won't stop me from appreciating a good, tragical paradox every now and then.
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: @PermanentFace: She seems like she is happier than she ever has been, considering all that she's achieved.
Slaying a mutated giant imp mother boss, learning spells that she thought she had no chance of learning, conquering her alcohol(lets hope she doesn't relapse).
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: Its harder for a non alcoholic to understand. Alcoholics(and people who drink due to depression) are not happy. Now it would be for a drunk, of course they are happy, they are happy being drunk.
Drunks and Alcoholics are not the same thing.
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: @Adroma: I can say, that I wouldn't desert Katia for her alcohol problems, even if things get awkward, I'd still be her friend. Because I understand alcoholics, I lived with one my entire life, my mother. I've seen almost every stupid thing she did, she took me almost every where she went, from every Mexican restaurant with a bar, to every neighborhood redneck party. Thankfully, I steer my self away from drinking before it become a problem.
Adroma: @MetalC0Mmander: Okay, I don't want to be rude, but this is how alcohol works, to be happy while drinking, you had to be happy beforehand. Alcohol amplifies your mood, so if you're super sad, it only gets worse and alcoholics know this yet they continue drinking for the numbness it provides. There is definitely false happiness, like when you try to ignore how terrible everything is and smile when you really want to go kill yourself. I can assume from very personal experience that all ALCOHOLICS, are depressed on some level.
ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: @Adroma: I can also, from personal experience. My mom suffers from crippling depression, and bipolar disorder, on top of her being an alcoholic.
MetalC0Mmander: Well I guess you guys are right but I'm not gonna I'm wrong either even if I don't have actual experience with the subject. Could be it's different from one person to the other. Anyway I guess it doesn't matter since we all agree that alchool is a poor way to fix one's problems.
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Not sure if this is anywhere on the borru already.
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How scandalous, to be seen in a zakoozy with a Cultist! Blame the Nord Ale!
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What do they hold -- beer mugs? ...body scrubbers? ...coin purses?
Has an insect just landed near his right eye?
"Hey, what's up with you, man?"
=o_o= Lord of plots taught this one to trust not a damn thing around.
Nice style though.
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Also remember she blacks out the majority of the time, so she never really 'enjoys her self'. She said she was even sometimes conscious enough remember the stupid shit she did while drunk.
I don't get it, why do some in the prequel community justify her alcoholism? It's a problem she shouldn't embrace as its why she failed most of her life.
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She experiences numbness and temporary relief from emotional pain, that is not happiness. Especially when she sobers up, all that emotional pain is back, and even worse than before.
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Katia must either be drinking something very light here, or this is an alternate reality where she can handle her booze
Whatever the case, it's nice to see them both having a good laugh (Whoever he is. Nameless Nord? Fan character? Who knows?)
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And don't get me wrong I'm not saying that any kind of addictions magicaly fix problems or won't cause more but when someone tells you those make them feel better the least you can do is try to understand them.
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Alcoholism isn't a good thing. It's untenable, it leads to deeper troughs of despair in the aftermath, and Katia's struggle to overcome it is altogether admirable. I'm rooting for her all the way. But that won't stop me from appreciating a good, tragical paradox every now and then.
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Slaying a mutated giant imp mother boss, learning spells that she thought she had no chance of learning, conquering her alcohol(lets hope she doesn't relapse).
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Drunks and Alcoholics are not the same thing.
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