comkiller: @Rick2tails: Because the booru's first page being littered with your_weird_OC self-inserts, potentially turning off new members is... "good"?
comkiller: @ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: "I'm not going to live there. There's no place for me there, any more than there is for you. Malcolm... I'm a monster. What I do is evil. I have no illusions about it, but it must be done." But seriously, I'm a snarky prick irregardless.
Grape: @ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: @comkiller: Calling a mean person mean words makes you as bad as them. That goes for both sides, here. But yeah, lern 2 blacklist.
Nicros_Man: @AMKitsune: @Dawoc: Yes that's exactly what I was trying to say. If you guys don't like my work, why not blacklist my name. Please, I didn't start the drama and I don't want to start another one because of one drawing. I have a bad experience about last time. Kazerad was mad at me and I was so guilty. So please, blacklist my name if you don't like my work.
Zargothrax: @AMKitsune: I sincerely believed the blacklisting feature would solve the disharmony on the boruu, yet it seems I was mistaken.
The rabbit hole goes deeper.
Grape: @comkiller: It actually isn't! It's a mixture of "regardless" and "irrespective" that applies a double negative to the word. Dictionaries list it as nonstandard.
Sorry, I care more about this now than fanart, carry on
comkiller: @Grape: That actually doesn't matter. It's established in the English lexicon firmly meaning "X", and that makes it a word meaning "X". Dictionaries do not determine what is and is not a word, but instead are ever-changing catalogs of the constantly evolving languages in the world. Setting aside more natural evolutions such as irregardless, one merely has to look at the works of Lewis Carroll, especially his poem "Jabberwocky" in which he spliced together words to make jubberish that conveyed feeling purely through context and thr "texture" of said words. After 150 years, half of these words similarly entrenched themselves into the English lexicon and are accepted words with accepted meanings, irregardless of their nonsensical origins.
Grape: @comkiller: Descriptivism is all well and good until rules don't exist and apostrophes are long dead. Be a forerunner of the new language if you like but using nonstandard english is going to make people think you don't know what you're talking about, regardless of your explanations.
Tenegan: I ain't saying that i dislike the picture itself, there's just too much.
And if someone blacklists these tags, they could miss something interesting, so that kinda won't work.
Didn't mean to start this, though.
comkiller: @Grape: Rules don't make the language, the language makes the rules, and so the rules of the English language are about as solid as the Earth's crust: not so much appearing and disappearing, but constantly crashing into each other, shattering apart, and making new stuff in a language where exceptions to a rule can be more numerous than examples. Which is exacerbated by the fact that English is a bastardized language made from bastardized languages. And just saying "it's not a word" is going to make people who actually formally study and understand what's going into the language think you don't know what you're talking about. It's like a lasagna made from feelings of smug academic superiority.
Dawoc: @ThatGuyWithAKhajiitWaifu: I wouldn't necessarily say that's the case. I personally don't really care, but I can see why some people are getting annoyed.
Like I mentioned 1/4 of art submitted to the booru these days is exclusively Nicros_Man stuff. Now, this wouldn't really be a problem, if it wasn't for the fact that most of it seem to focus on his OCs and AU story, which kind of has the effect of making this place resemble something of a personal DeviantArt gallery.
Sure, they could just blacklist the "your_weird_OC" or "artist:nicros_man" tag, but then they might miss something they'll like. Because they might not be against people drawing their OCs interacting with Prequel characters on principle, or even Nicros_Man's art (because he's not a bad artist), just where the focus of a lot of his art seems to lay and the sheer amount.
I also think how new people will react to this is a somewhat valid concern. New people are going to come in and see a significant portion of the fanart page filled with what is seemingly one guy's wish fulfillment. Now, how will they react to this? That's a valid question.
Like I said, I personally don't care one way or the other, but I thought I'd weigh in, because I think calling the people who have an issue with this "whiner looking for something to complain about" is a bit unfair.
AMKitsune: @Dawoc: Just going to quickly point out that blacklists can be a hell of a lot more specific than blocking an image based on a single tag. Full details on the help page.
Zargothrax: I recall quarrels of similar nature back when OC shipping fanarts weren’t so popular too.
Obviously the quantity of these submissions (nowadays) didn’t help, but this points towards that the problem originates from the nature of these images primarily, not their amount. Or rather, the way these pictures makes some viewers feel.
Perception is such a strange thing. Vision in this case. We receive a bunch of electromagnetic waves, on different frequencies, this triggers millions of signals to be sent on arbitrary neural networks (formed by all our past experiences), which will construct something we abstractly refer to as a feeling, or emotion. Where am I getting at? These networks are person-to-person, so everyone feels differently about these images. Considering that not everyone gets triggered, raises the question, that maybe the real issue that sparks the fights isn’t in the pictures, but in certain viewers. Think about it. Why would someone drawing pictures of fictional cats kissing cause discomfort to people? Isn’t this absurd a little?
Well, for the record, people watching the boruu, are by definition people who care about Prequel and Katia, so that’s one part of the puzzle solved. But this doesn’t explain why blacklisting didn’t stop the disputes (although it did help somewhat). This leaves one option only: The offense isn’t taken in the unpleasantness of having to look at these drawings in some people, but in their mere existence (eg.: „how dare you draw that of her!”). This behaviour leans towards being awfully protective about a fictional character. Yet the more of a fan someone is of a story (and thus its characters), the higher the probability they might care for them. And it would be so strange, to scold people for liking Prequel on this website right? (still, manners tho)
Well, this doesn’t explain why people aren’t upset about the stuff made for the… erm… other boruu. The obvious difference is that that’s there, and this is here. Different places for different purposes and audiences. This implies that people treat the boruu as being consistent. So, for instance, if I made shipping art of Katia and an OC, that would make people think that Katia, Nick, and this OC are in a love triangle. But that’s utterly wrong! These should be considered to be in their own „pocket dimension”, they are all supposed to be separate. And now I think because of this, people believe that the boruu’s Katia is claimed by some OC (who’s an outsider to most of us), which is a notion incompatible with playing nicely together (meaning the problem isn’t in the drawing, but rather how we conceive the boruu). Maybe emphasising the detachment with a „fanfiction” tag or placing them in a separate (consistent) pool or something could help that, but I don’t know at this point, this is getting wierd.
I’m not going to lie, the reason why this topic interests me is because these drawings make me feel slightly uncomfortable too (not so much that I would start blacklisting). And because I like this community and miss when it was more pieceful. Also, sorry for the babbling, I’m tired. For me in some ways that has similar effects to being drunk for other people.
CaptainLackwit: I'd just really like if Nicros got an FA or DA or something and just posted this swathe of art to that. For me it's not a matter of posessiveness or protectiveness. I don't give two shits who Katia's with- though I do object to the notion of a reinterpretation/derivation of what is -already- derivative.
The sheer
VOLUME
is what bugs me, and all on the same subject like a hyperfixation. Hell, I'm perturbed that this is the prequel content we're getting more frequently than the main thing itself- like, I just.
There's something inherently presumptuous about one making their own version of what is -already- fanfiction, and then making what most certainly feels like a self insert to ship specifically with Katia, and make that like, the whole focus of the thing.
This alternate prequel is less about katia becoming successful and overcoming her old self and more about a romance that one dude wants to make, but can't fit into the existing narrative, so a whole new one that's nowhere close to the same has to be made.
So like, why even bother doing that in the first place?
Why not just make something new, with all this creative capability? That's what keeps me confused and perturbed.
Nicros, if you're reading this, try not to be offended or angered, or feel browbeaten by what I'm saying.
But you're a fucking talented artist, and you clearly want to create good stories, and have broad, sweeping visions of what something could be...
Sashimi: I agree with Nicros in that it's the source material that caused the inspiration and passion to create something personal. It's the same for me with Rajirra. I never had any kind of desire or inclination to write a story, or commission artwork until I read Prequel, then something clicked. It's something I care very deeply about. We don't choose the things we love, it just happens, and I'm happy people can find such enjoyment in artwork.
Zargothrax: @CaptainLackwit: I’m glad this is resolved then. Also looking back at tired-me, I was overthinking a little. But a few things I’d like to add (I know we’re over this, but I want it off my chest):
The possessiveness. I didn’t make that up. It was a genuine input from a boruu member under a drawing that sparked a very similar debate. So this standpoint is an existing one. I’d also like to add that the drawing (that I’m not going to reference) was uploaded over a year ago, when OC romance images were not posted in large volumes, still almost every time one appeared, flames followed.
Problems like these don’t just go away by themselves. Resolving them requires understanding both sides. In your case, it seems simple enough, but see the opinion above. It doesn’t really matter if this person is right, wrong, wierd, or anything. They exist, they come to the boruu like us. We either find a pieceful solution (the blacklisting feature was such a step), or start banning people (or do nothing and let the Mods clean after the flames till the end of time).
I’m no moderator, but I still care for this community, because it was probably the main inspiration for me to start drawing. I know, we can’t please everyone, but that doesn’t mean we can’t try, that’s all I’m getting at. Anyway, I’m glad to see how this ended, at least in this case.
Describe This Image As Dramatically As Possible
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i can hear the bombs whistling in the air
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i really like it!
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And learn that irregardless isn't a word.
Not picking a side here, just throwing out a statistic! Make of it what you will!
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The rabbit hole goes deeper.
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Sorry, I care more about this now than fanart, carry on
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And if someone blacklists these tags, they could miss something interesting, so that kinda won't work.
Didn't mean to start this, though.
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It's just like, half the booru at this point.
Like I mentioned 1/4 of art submitted to the booru these days is exclusively Nicros_Man stuff. Now, this wouldn't really be a problem, if it wasn't for the fact that most of it seem to focus on his OCs and AU story, which kind of has the effect of making this place resemble something of a personal DeviantArt gallery.
Sure, they could just blacklist the "your_weird_OC" or "artist:nicros_man" tag, but then they might miss something they'll like. Because they might not be against people drawing their OCs interacting with Prequel characters on principle, or even Nicros_Man's art (because he's not a bad artist), just where the focus of a lot of his art seems to lay and the sheer amount.
I also think how new people will react to this is a somewhat valid concern. New people are going to come in and see a significant portion of the fanart page filled with what is seemingly one guy's wish fulfillment. Now, how will they react to this? That's a valid question.
Like I said, I personally don't care one way or the other, but I thought I'd weigh in, because I think calling the people who have an issue with this "whiner looking for something to complain about" is a bit unfair.
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Obviously the quantity of these submissions (nowadays) didn’t help, but this points towards that the problem originates from the nature of these images primarily, not their amount. Or rather, the way these pictures makes some viewers feel.
Perception is such a strange thing. Vision in this case. We receive a bunch of electromagnetic waves, on different frequencies, this triggers millions of signals to be sent on arbitrary neural networks (formed by all our past experiences), which will construct something we abstractly refer to as a feeling, or emotion. Where am I getting at? These networks are person-to-person, so everyone feels differently about these images. Considering that not everyone gets triggered, raises the question, that maybe the real issue that sparks the fights isn’t in the pictures, but in certain viewers. Think about it. Why would someone drawing pictures of fictional cats kissing cause discomfort to people? Isn’t this absurd a little?
Well, for the record, people watching the boruu, are by definition people who care about Prequel and Katia, so that’s one part of the puzzle solved. But this doesn’t explain why blacklisting didn’t stop the disputes (although it did help somewhat). This leaves one option only: The offense isn’t taken in the unpleasantness of having to look at these drawings in some people, but in their mere existence (eg.: „how dare you draw that of her!”). This behaviour leans towards being awfully protective about a fictional character. Yet the more of a fan someone is of a story (and thus its characters), the higher the probability they might care for them. And it would be so strange, to scold people for liking Prequel on this website right? (still, manners tho)
Well, this doesn’t explain why people aren’t upset about the stuff made for the… erm… other boruu. The obvious difference is that that’s there, and this is here. Different places for different purposes and audiences. This implies that people treat the boruu as being consistent. So, for instance, if I made shipping art of Katia and an OC, that would make people think that Katia, Nick, and this OC are in a love triangle. But that’s utterly wrong! These should be considered to be in their own „pocket dimension”, they are all supposed to be separate. And now I think because of this, people believe that the boruu’s Katia is claimed by some OC (who’s an outsider to most of us), which is a notion incompatible with playing nicely together (meaning the problem isn’t in the drawing, but rather how we conceive the boruu). Maybe emphasising the detachment with a „fanfiction” tag or placing them in a separate (consistent) pool or something could help that, but I don’t know at this point, this is getting wierd.
I’m not going to lie, the reason why this topic interests me is because these drawings make me feel slightly uncomfortable too (not so much that I would start blacklisting). And because I like this community and miss when it was more pieceful. Also, sorry for the babbling, I’m tired. For me in some ways that has similar effects to being drunk for other people.
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The sheer
VOLUME
is what bugs me, and all on the same subject like a hyperfixation. Hell, I'm perturbed that this is the prequel content we're getting more frequently than the main thing itself- like, I just.
There's something inherently presumptuous about one making their own version of what is -already- fanfiction, and then making what most certainly feels like a self insert to ship specifically with Katia, and make that like, the whole focus of the thing.
This alternate prequel is less about katia becoming successful and overcoming her old self and more about a romance that one dude wants to make, but can't fit into the existing narrative, so a whole new one that's nowhere close to the same has to be made.
So like, why even bother doing that in the first place?
Why not just make something new, with all this creative capability? That's what keeps me confused and perturbed.
Nicros, if you're reading this, try not to be offended or angered, or feel browbeaten by what I'm saying.
But you're a fucking talented artist, and you clearly want to create good stories, and have broad, sweeping visions of what something could be...
But why make a derivation of derivative work?
Why not make something new?
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That is a genuinely good enough answer.
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The possessiveness. I didn’t make that up. It was a genuine input from a boruu member under a drawing that sparked a very similar debate. So this standpoint is an existing one. I’d also like to add that the drawing (that I’m not going to reference) was uploaded over a year ago, when OC romance images were not posted in large volumes, still almost every time one appeared, flames followed.
Problems like these don’t just go away by themselves. Resolving them requires understanding both sides. In your case, it seems simple enough, but see the opinion above. It doesn’t really matter if this person is right, wrong, wierd, or anything. They exist, they come to the boruu like us. We either find a pieceful solution (the blacklisting feature was such a step), or start banning people (or do nothing and let the Mods clean after the flames till the end of time).
I’m no moderator, but I still care for this community, because it was probably the main inspiration for me to start drawing. I know, we can’t please everyone, but that doesn’t mean we can’t try, that’s all I’m getting at. Anyway, I’m glad to see how this ended, at least in this case.
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Couldn't agree more. And sometimes it really is so damn random, we can't even explain it to ourselves, let alone to someone else.
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... Is it... is it over yet? (:) >)':^/
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